Players to Forgive + Dynasty Debates, Offseason Magic - Fantasy Football Podcast for 2/22

making choices about who they're playing that week and letting guys go into the free agent pool that might be nice holds because then other people can speculate. A lot of speculation on the waiver wire is fun and entertaining. Yeah, and to speak to the complaining about IR, that is for fun and entertainment. I mean, no, I appreciate it, Jason. Thank you. It's just the truth. We complain about a lot of stuff in fantasy that grinds our gears. If we fix it. What are we going to complain about? We have nothing to talk about. We'll find something else to complain about, but it's like a sign of respect and love that we're so frustrated that this guy's not marked out yet. It's fun. That's why we mostly choose things that can't be changed to complain about. Right. Because we kind of, we want to back ourselves into a nice corner there. And the while one of us, when you have the player on the IR, you are the one who is complaining.

the other people are enjoying it so much. Oh, it's a lot of fun. When I know that my opponent is now hamstrung because of the player who's in the IR and they can't make a move, I'm happy about it. Every morning that Mike posts, why won't they take this guy out off the IR, he's complaining. I'm going, yeah, you're grabbing the popcorn bucket, sitting back having a good time. I hope they take longer to move his. Yeah, so it's, yeah, it's just part of the game. Yeah. Just not the dune popcorn. All right, we have a couple of, oh, man. Move it along. We have a couple of Breece Hall questions. Let's go toss that right in there. Moving along. Cessina says, Breece Hall or Jamar Chase in a one keeper league. Is one keeper league? Okay, so this is basically redraft. I will shock you to say I think it's pretty darn close. Oh, I think it is exceptionally close. I will.

If this was a startup, I'm going to take chase over Brees. No, this is just a reader. No, no, no, but that's what I'm, or yes, I said startup as an dynasty, but I meant just basically redraft. That's, that's how I'm viewing it. Just a normal draft, I would take chase ahead of them. Me too. It's close, but that's how I lean. That's really tough. I really, really like Brees Hall this year. Like running back too. Yeah, Brees Hall can be. Just like I've always said. This is the game. One of my guys. If everything goes right, of course. But if Aaron Rogers is healthy and they make any sort of adjustments, improvements to the offensive line, Breece Hall can be an almost CMC level impact to your fantasy lineup because he catches so many passes. You can have two players in one spot. I.

I think I would gamble. I think I'd gamble with Brees Hall. How could they not improve that offensive line? Because sometimes J, T, T, S, Jets, Jets, Jets. They didn't improve it this year. If they got rid of, like if they played with four, it's got to be better. It's got to be there. I just don't know how it could be as bad as what they were last year. Honestly, the fact that things go wrong for the Jets factors into the tie for me. But. You're just betting on history. I'm just betting on history. Yeah. The follow-up question is Brise Hall, the new dynasty RB1, if not then who? He is not for me. It's Bijon for me. It's Bijan for me. I have Jemir Gibbs at one. Ooh, spicy. Jamir Gibbs is number two for me. But I mean, I look, if you could program them to scramble every day, that's fine too. I mean, all those guys are right in the mix. So Breast is a great one.

There is an article exclusive to the Dynasty Pass right now. It's a great article. Great article. It's called the Dynasty Life Cycle of Running Backs. Yeah, Big Marv put that. He's done tremendous work for us for years. And we said, let's get some exclusive stuff into the Dino Pass, man. And he said, yeah. You want to talk about life cycles of running backs? We said, yeah. And he did. And the other positions will be coming out as well. All right, Instagram question. Trading draft picks and redraft. Yes. Yay or nay? Sorry, Mike. That is not one of the answers he would like. Yay. Yay. Yay. Okay. What? Right. I know where we're going. We need a drop that's like Mike analyzes the English language. Begin. Why would, why were we doing that? What? Like when you vote, yeah, I want yay or nay? And it's like,

Here's the bigger problem. One is silly because yay is now a word that means like, yay, like fun, but they rhyme. You know what I mean? Right. Yes and no. It's the same vowel sound and they're yes and no. You are not mixing those up. You could get yay or nay. Yay. Was that a yay or was that a nay? It's a little easier to be loud with the word yay. Yeah, you can't be very loud with yes. But you can really, are you cool with that? I do. I accept that. The answer, so they both come from the old English. Yeah, but old busted English. But it does appear that the reason that you vote with, yay or nay is because it rhymes. And it sounds great. It does sound great. They want it. They want the confusion. They want to, they want to be able to say yay or nay. That just flows, you know. And then at the end, they go the.

These are the decision makers. The yeas have it. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. As opposed to the yeses. Yeah. The yeses have it. The yeses have it? Yeah, Mike. Come on. Sorry. Grow up, Mike. Old English wins again. The vote passes. I mean, what's wrong with that? What? You know what? It doesn't rhyme. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you, Annie. All right. Instagram question. Sam wants to know what our favorite type of league to play in is. Redraft Keeper or Dynasty. I am in the keeper camp. I am in the keeper camp as well. I am a keeper as well. Which is ironic because I think it is the least... It's the minority of those three. It's... It's easier to find a redraft league and easier to find a dynasty league. Keepers, though, are to me the absolute chef's kiss of a combination where you get year-round play, you get off-season magic, and yet the waiver wire, the draft day is... Yeah, you preserve the draft.

But you still have players. Yeah, it's wonderful. Part of that might be because keeper formats are all over the map. Some people keep one or three or five. Yeah, there's not like a universal sign up for a keeper league and everyone's playing the same format. Maybe like our league of record format should be called what a keeper league is. Like that can just become the Coca-Cola of formats. We should just talk to sleeper and be like, hey, make our league the default keeper league. Well, I vote yay. Yay. Okay. Oh, my man. All right, quick break. At least it rhymed. Another quick break. Back with some more questions. This question comes from YouTube. Kyle Reader wants to know, is Giovante Williams going to get back into the conversation of RB1 territory after a year of recovery? Or did McLaughlin do enough to split that backfield? Javante Williams is entering the final year of his rookie contract. He is not yet 24 years old. He had three rushing touchdowns on 217 attempts.

Most people think Russell Wilson will be gone. I am part of most people. But I will say no, I don't think so. So you're not going to forgive Giovante Williams? No. You know, I don't feel like he's in need of forgiveness necessarily because he's never done it. I mean, he's had spurts and games in the past. Then he got injured. I'm not, you know, you don't have to forgive a guy for getting hurt. And then he didn't deliver this year, but that's. I need to forgive players that have a standard they've set, and then they don't meet it. And to me, Javatha just didn't look good. I mean, to me, he just didn't look that good. He looked fine. I don't think he looked fine. I think he looked pretty poor. The question is going to be, obviously, he came back and surprised everyone with his timeline for getting back from a horrific knee injury. It wasn't a straight ACL. It was one that you just did not think he'd be able to get back in time.

for the start of the season. We assumed he'd start on the pup and then get back slowly, maybe by the end of the season, start showing up. Instead, he got out week one. He got out to preseason games and played in the preseason, shocking the fantasy world. And I think maybe that makes us forget that that usual timeline on recovery from that injury, you know, is really the next year where you come back to form. And there is a world that exists where he is back to his old self. I think because of the contract situation and the draft capital and the roster needs of the Broncos, there is a good chance Giovante enters the season with a similar depth chart and gets a lot of opportunity. He's like Romandre, right? Same year. Yeah, yeah. So it's one of those where you get to see, was it the injury or did he not?

Was he not that dude? And it's so hard to watch how he played last year and say, well, it's going to totally change. It was all the injury. He's going to be great this year. Very difficult to have that, but I do think it's worth the intellectual exercise of remembering that specific injury and the normal expectations for it. This isn't revisionist history or, you know, after the season. finding out that, oh, he was, he was hurt more than we thought. This was like, we knew he was supposed to be bad this year. It just he was. He's going to have wide range of outcomes because McLaughlin is a player that the current regime opted for, right? Sure. Go ahead, Mike. So the, what's, what's hard about evaluating Giovante is like, we have Breece Hall. Okay, Bruce Hall, Torres, ACL.

He comes back. I can't recall. I think Brees's might have been a relatively easier injury to come back for. But Brees Hall was not himself over the first half of the season or so. But eventually you started to, and he was like inefficiency on the ground, but eventually you saw, oh, yeah, like I can see. Vintage. I can see Brees Hall. I can see the guy that we all fell in love with. And Javante to me just never had that game. at any point in the season where I said, oh, there's, that's Giovante, that's the guy who was drafted in the second round. So, I mean, I was regularly impressed by McLaughlin. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, he was lined with, more electric. Yes. Yeah, and that's, so the fact that we didn't see it, that's where it becomes so hard to, the RB1 range, it won't be talked about it like that, but.

I will leave the window cracked because I thought he was such an outstanding prospect and was so excited that there is a chance. And, of course, the Sean Payton history with running backs has, it's been good to fantasy football players. So a chance, but highly skeptical. You saw nothing. And McLaughlin, he looked really, really good. But the team did not give him that much work. I think he made some plays that caught. your eye, but the team still gave the majority of work, the vast majority of work to the underperforming Giovante. So would it surprise you that Somagny P. Ryan somehow had 50 catches for 455 yards in the passing game? Yeah, it does surprise me. That shocks me. Feels like he was deleted from the roster at some point in the season. It felt like 50 empty catches.

I guess that team didn't feel too good overall until that run. All right, let's move on here. Instagram question from Zach in a new dynasty startup. Is it worth it to draft CMC first overall? No. Probably not, but close. No. Yeah, I mean, a dynasty startup. When you have Bijon and Brise at the ages that they're at with the potential, like there's no guarantee that they don't beat McCaffrey this year. Yeah, there is a guarantee that they have a longer career from this point. If McCaffrey was guaranteed to be the number one relative to the talent out there beyond him, I think. To me, it's not a matter of Bajon. Was it worth it last year? If last year McCaffrey was number one pick in a dynasty startup, would you say you made the right pick? I would still say no, but not because of Bijon and Bres, but because of the other top tier wide receivers. I would much rather like.

I was only thinking running backs. Yeah, I was only... If I'm starting a new dynasty startup and I can get my hands on a Justin Jefferson, a Jamar Chase, a C.D. Lamb. So let's change the question, because I meant it just in respect to the other running backs. Okay. Only as the RB one overall, the number one picked in a dynasty startup at running back. Yeah, it would have been worth it. Last year, would it have been worth it to take him over Bijon or Bresol? For sure. The year that you got in hindsight. Because you're going to get three full years, right? You're going to get the year you just got, and then this upcoming year and probably another full year. Yeah, so I say at that point you would have gotten three. Is that enough? Yeah, that's enough. I mean, what do you score? 20 straight games? I mean, right now, CMC is still already a top five.

dynasty running back. He's at two for me. He is at two for me. Wow. I know you both probably have Brees and Bijon ahead of it. Yeah, and Gibbs. I do have Gibbs ahead. It's just the, I think you have this year, but I mean, running backs just hit some, some special outlier running backs happen and maybe he is that for longevity. But I wouldn't bet. the start of my dynasty team of running backs against that, of that third year. The third year could happen where I feel quite confident in all those other guys that, yeah, year three, they're still going to be producing. When we're having this conversation again next off season, Christian McCaffrey will be 28.7 years old. So that's.

He's going to be fine. See, I'm in that camp. He's going to be fine. There are certain players that you have, I mean, we just had Rahim Moster at 31 and a half be the number two fantasy running back. When you're, you know, the age cliff for running backs, when you look at it as a totality, it's not fair to the outlier running backs. The human beings that are first ballot Hall of Famer, like, he's better. He's more special. And he's that way for a reason, both. genetically and work ethic and mentally and what, you know, the whole, all the ingredients to make the CMC soup, he will be good at 30 years old. Which is a Olympic swimmer and a former NFL player? Yeah. That's a pretty good combo. So, yeah, I mean, that is. My mom and dad really let me down. Yeah, it's on them. My parents should have been in the Olympics. Yeah, and the NFL.

I think it's interesting to bring up what you did because, you know, it feels like one of those things where some aspects of fantasy football are right in front of your face. And Henry's probably a decent example of this over the last three years. Like the Henry discussions about Derek Henry being too old began a while back. Right? Oh, yeah. It wasn't just last year. I mean, last year was like, and he was fine. I mean, he wasn't. He wasn't daring. Yeah, he was not the Yeti. But like the preceding two or three years, we did that. It was a mistake. We did that with Gore, obviously. We've done that with a handful of old people. Old people. Yeah, old people. So this guy turning 40. But yeah, I feel like if you're sitting there and Christian McCaffey's right in front of your face and then you're just like, no, I'm going to just analytics this only because of age and not on anything else. Yeah, in the end. What percentage of players, this is where analytics gets.

Funky to me. What percentage of players who have finished the year at number one and done the things that Christian McCaffrey has done in the past two years drop off the next year? You know, like we don't have enough. In 500 years of football, you'd have enough samples of that. But there's only a handful of McCaffrey's that have ever played. So it's like you don't get to compare him apples to apples. You compare him with inferior players. Yeah, you can't do average. running backs and then compare them to the outliers. It just can't do it. It won't make sense. So if you wanted to tell me that you would rather take CMC over those other running backs for Dynasty, in the end, what matters and what wins championships are fantasy points scored, and Christian McCaffrey will do that. So I don't mind that. The gameplay was the wide receiver's lifespan.

not just lifespan, but perceived dynasty value, you know, four years from now, even if he's near the end, you will get tons. You can get a haul for Justin Jefferson. Four years from now, you won't get that even for Brise. Like now all of a sudden he'll be seen as more of an expiring asset. Yeah. And so I have a hard time pulling that trigger. But if you're just talking running backs and dynasty. Yeah, score fantasy points. Mike, just so, you know, I can already like picture Mike next year on this show, like cackling when McCaffrey somehow struggles. Oh, I would not. He's my league of record champion. I need him to be good. Yeah, that's true. Let me ask you this, though, because just to expand the discussion, I think it's a good one on dynasty in general. Like we're talking about short terms, long terms, most total fantasy points over a small period, most over a long period. But, you know,

The longevity of wide receiver is well known. Like, that's why they go first. But the importance and value of elite play at running back is also very evident because there's less of them that have the ability to put a team on their back and win you a title. I mean, that has been proven in redraft. And you still play the same players in a dynasty league, right? The same amount, generally speaking, you know, two running backs. two or three wide receivers. So in that respect, the importance of running back is significant. I just think that's a very interesting kind of value gamble to take. You want to have Jefferson because you want to have an asset that's valuable for 10 years. But you could trade titles. Yeah, but I will say that while CMC might have slightly higher odds to separate, you could also have.

Jefferson, C.D. Lamb this last year is a perfect example. CD Lamb won people title. Yeah, for sure. When you're still the elite of the elite at the wide receiver position, you can go out there and straight up win someone a title plus the longevity. What if the best running backs in football are on your dynasty team, but all they can do is get you to the championship game? Then I would call myself Andy Holloway. Yeah, let's say I won a championship with pretty subpar. We were actually completely flipped in our two leagues. You won with McCaffrey. I'm sorry, I lost with McCaffrey. I won with Lamb. Oh, wait, no, that's the same, isn't it? Yeah. You both won with wide receivers. All right, can we delete the last 10 minutes or so of the pod? All right. You know what? I could have won. McCaffrey. What did you go out? Halfway through the game. Cheater.

That would be you. You're the cheater. Howdy Ho-Ballers. What is a good offer for Jalen Waddle and Dynasty? CD-Land. Oh, that is it. That is very weird. That'll get it done. It'll get done. That'll get done. Oh, man. Well, I mean, what? Oh, man. Waddle is like a spear through Jason's heart. Waddle is still an excellent. player he's still a great dynasty player he i probably win the championship this year oh i don't know hush now chiles i mean my my my team is was really good was in the playoffs if i had cdiam because you know it's true hush shot you guys talked me into losing the championship quiet down simmer down uh i was like waddle might be a like a great low target right now yeah

of this year is weighing very heavily on how people think about him. We teach people not to blame the fantasy analyst, Jason. What about when you're literally sandwiched between them? I mean, I guess you just got to have courage. I guess so. I'm a weak coward. I think going and get Waddle right now is at least kick the tires. He doesn't feel the same way this offseason as he did last season. So that's generally a good sign. That's when you swoop in. If you believe in the town. But a good offer, I mean, it'll still take a lot. It'll still take a, at least someone you can start and then what? What would you take right now, Jay? Mike Evans? Sidney Lamb, that would take him back. Give him to me back. No, I would not take Mike Evans, no. No, Jaylon was 25 years old. Jason, you're just going through your roster. Yeah, I am. Yeah, I think you'd have to have a top five pick. I don't think that's happening. I would not trade.

Waddle away for a top five. Really? Wait, I mean, I would trade Waddle away for a top five pick. Yeah, so you would prefer the top five pick. Wow. Really? Andy. I would definitely prefer the first two. I go beyond. Yeah, I wouldn't do that now. I'd have to wait to find landing spots. Interesting. But I would, in a startup, I would like if if rookies were included, I'd take Malik neighbor and Marvin Harrison over Waddle. What was that name again? Neighbors. Like neighbors. That's what I said. Yeah. Yeah. You do have this strange habit of removing or adding S's to people's names. I just, there's only one of them. And so this is a real hard. Oh, because you know that there's one. Right. Human. Right. And so his last name is plural. It's plural. There's not two of them. Hmm. You know? So I'm a home. Thank you. Yeah. All right. That is going to do it for today's show. Coaching changes episode next week.

along with our 10 Things to Remember episode on Thursday. You don't want to miss those. Make sure you subscribe. Leave us a review. We'll be back with you then. Goodbye. Thank you for listening to another episode of the Fantasy Footballers podcast. Join our fantasy football community on join thefoot.com. And follow us on Twitter at the FF ballers.